Volodymyr Zelenskyy: Ukraine, War, Peace, Putin, Trump, NATO, and Freedom | Lex Fridman Podcast #456

Understanding the Russia-Ukraine War: Origins and Current Situation

• What happened between Russia and Ukraine before the war started?
  

  After the Soviet Union broke up in 1991, Ukraine and Russia had ups and downs in their friendship. Here's what happened:

  1. Orange Revolution (2004) - Ukraine elected a president who wanted to be friends with Europe instead of Russia
  2. Yanukovych Years (2010-2014) - Then Ukraine elected a president who wanted to be closer to Russia
  3. Euromaidan Protests (2013) - People in Ukraine got angry when their president stopped talking to Europe
  4. Russia Takes Crimea (2014) - Russia grabbed a piece of Ukraine called Crimea
  5. War in Eastern Ukraine - Fighting started in the Donbas region that killed over 14,000 people
  6. Full Invasion (2022) - Russia attacked all of Ukraine from many directions

  Russia's President Putin believed Ukraine should be part of Russia, not an independent country looking to join Western groups like NATO.

• What does Ukraine need to feel safe after the war ends?
  

  President Zelenskyy believes Ukraine needs strong safety promises to have real peace. Here's what Ukraine wants:

  1. NATO membership - Joining this big defense club would protect Ukraine because an attack on one NATO member means all other members must help
  2. Military support - Ukraine needs weapons and equipment to defend itself
  3. Money from frozen Russian assets - Using Russia's money that was frozen in banks to help rebuild Ukraine
  4. Strong sanctions on Russia - Keeping rules that limit Russia's economy to prevent them from building a big army again
  5. American involvement - Zelenskyy specifically believes the United States must be part of any security deal

  Zelenskyy says without these guarantees, Russia might just wait a few years and attack again. He points out that previous security promises (like the Budapest Memorandum when Ukraine gave up nuclear weapons) were just "pieces of paper" that nobody followed.

• Why is speaking Russian now a big deal in Ukraine?
  

  Before the war, many Ukrainians spoke Russian in their daily lives - including President Zelenskyy himself! But the war changed everything:

  1. Russian as a weapon - Putin claimed he invaded to "protect Russian speakers" in Ukraine
  2. Identity shift - Speaking Ukrainian became a way to show you support Ukraine's independence
  3. Emotional connection - Many Ukrainians now avoid Russian because it reminds them of the attackers
  4. Not banned - Zelenskyy clarifies that Russian isn't forbidden in Ukraine, but people choose not to use it
  5. Future relations - Like after World War II with Germany, it may take generations before normal cultural relations return

  Zelenskyy explained that this isn't about hating the language itself - it's that when the people attacking you speak Russian, it naturally creates distance from

War and Peace: How Countries Work Together To End Fighting

• Why did the 2019 peace talks fail and how could Trump's talks be different?
  
  President Zelenskyy explains that the 2019 ceasefire failed because:

  1. Putin wasn't serious - He didn't know details about borders or timing, suggesting he never planned to follow through
  2. Broken promises - Russia started killing Ukrainians again just one month after the ceasefire agreement
  3. No security guarantees - There was nothing stopping Russia from attacking again

  With Trump, Zelenskyy believes things could be different because Trump has the power to pressure Putin to stop fighting, not just ask nicely. But Ukraine needs to be in a strong position with weapons and security guarantees before any talks happen.
• How do different leaders' styles affect chances for peace in Ukraine?
  
  Different leaders approach peace talks in very different ways:

  1. Trump's approach - Uses strength and deal-making. Zelenskyy believes Trump can pressure Putin to stop the war using America's power and influence
  2. Putin's approach - According to Zelenskyy, Putin doesn't truly want peace. He breaks agreements and uses talks to buy time while planning more attacks
  3. European leaders - Often follow America's lead but are important because Ukraine is part of Europe

  Zelenskyy thinks the best path is first meeting with Trump to create a strong plan, then having Europe support it, and only then negotiating with Russia. The order matters!
• How could countries not taking sides help make peace between Ukraine and Russia?
  
  Countries from the Global South (like nations in Africa, Asia, and South America) could help make peace by:

  1. Being fair witnesses - They can see both sides since they often have relationships with both Russia and Ukraine
  2. Economic pressure - Countries like India and Saudi Arabia could help enforce rules about oil prices that limit Russia's war money
  3. Building future partnerships - They could help Ukraine build new business relationships for after the war

  Zelenskyy mentions that while these countries try to stay balanced between both sides, they still recognize that Russia started the war. This shared understanding could help create peace terms that everyone sees as fair.

How Ukraine Is Managing War While Planning for Peace

• How is Ukraine handling democracy during wartime, and when will elections happen?
  

  During the war, Ukraine has had to make some difficult choices:

  1. Martial law was necessary because Russia invaded Ukraine, not because leaders wanted more power
  2. Despite wartime, Ukraine has maintained important freedoms where possible, like keeping businesses running
  3. Ukraine has continued passing anti-corruption reforms even during the conflict

  President Zelenskyy says elections will happen within 90 days after the war ends. This is because:

  1. It's hard to hold fair elections when 8.5 million people have fled the country
  2. Soldiers (almost 1 million people) need a way to vote fairly
  3. Once martial law ends, Ukraine can immediately begin the election process
• What digital and economic plans does Ukraine have to rebuild after the war?
  

  Ukraine is focusing on several smart areas to rebuild their country:

  1. Digital transformation is their top priority - Ukraine already has the best digital government services in Europe through their "Diia" app
  2. Digital services fight corruption because people don't need personal connections to get government help
  3. Ukraine plans a major tax reform to encourage businesses to return
  4. They want to develop natural resources including:
     • Oil and gas in the Black Sea
     • The largest uranium and gold reserves in Europe
     • Green energy including solar power
  5. They're seeking international partnerships with American and European companies to invest in these resources
• How is Ukraine fighting corruption while dealing with war?
  

  Ukraine is working hard to show they're using international help properly:

  1. Strong anti-corruption systems are already in place - President Zelenskyy says Ukraine has "the most sophisticated anti-corruption system in all of Europe"
  2. Real consequences for corruption:
     • Ukraine has put powerful oligarchs in prison
     • They've cracked down on anyone caught misusing resources
  3. Most aid comes as weapons, not money - "In most cases, we did not receive money, we received weapons"
  4. Fighting Russian disinformation about corruption is as important as fighting actual corruption
  5. Digital services make corruption harder by removing personal interactions in government services

  President Zelenskyy says stealing during wartime is unthinkable: "Our soldiers would kill such people with their own hands... Do you honestly think anyone could steal weapons by the truckload when we ourselves don't have enough on the front lines?"

How War Affects Children and Families in Ukraine

• What happens to people living in areas Russia controls?
  
  People living under Russian control face very difficult times:

  1. They might be forced to fight - Many people in occupied areas are made to join the Russian army, even if they don't want to
  2. They aren't free to speak up - People who protest or disagree with Russia might be hurt or killed
  3. Many people disappeared - In places like Mariupol, thousands of people were taken away and no one knows what happened to them
  4. Children are taught different things - Russia changes what children learn in schools

  President Zelenskyy worries especially about the millions of children living in these areas who can't be protected.
• How does war hurt people's feelings inside and outside Ukraine?
  
  The war has hurt people's hearts and minds in many ways:

  1. Families are split apart - About 8.5 million people left Ukraine, meaning many families now live in different countries
  2. Children feel scared - Kids have to study in bomb shelters and hear air raid sirens
  3. People feel homesick - Refugees miss their homes, language, and normal life
  4. Everyone has trauma - People who lost family members or saw terrible things happen have painful memories
  5. Identity questions - The war has made Ukrainians think more about their language and culture

  President Zelenskyy mentioned how children who returned to school were happy to see friends again, even though they had to study underground in shelters.
• Can Ukrainians and Russians be friends again someday?
  
  President Zelenskyy believes people could be friends again someday, but only after:

  1. Russia must admit it was wrong - Like Germany did after World War II, Russia would need to acknowledge it was the aggressor
  2. Russia must apologize - The country needs to say sorry for what happened
  3. Justice must happen - People who committed crimes should be punished
  4. Russia must pay to rebuild - Money to fix what was destroyed should come from Russia

  President Zelenskyy said this healing will likely take generations, just like after other big wars in history. The children and grandchildren of those fighting today might someday have normal relationships again.

World Leaders: How Presidents Talk and Act During War

• How did being a TV star help Zelenskyy talk to people during war?
  
  President Zelenskyy's TV experience helps him in three big ways:

  1. Making quick videos: He knows how to make simple videos that people trust. When Russians said he ran away, he went outside to show he was still in Kyiv.
  2. Speaking to everyone: He talks to people 3-5 times daily during tough times, like when cities were cut off from information.
  3. Creating big networks: He made a special TV program called "Marathon" that connected all Ukrainian news so people always had true information.

  Just like a teacher knows how to explain things to students, Zelenskyy used his TV skills to help people understand what was happening during scary times.
• What does Zelenskyy think is inside Putin's head about the war?
  
  Zelenskyy sees Putin as someone who:

  1. Doesn't love his people: He sends young soldiers (just 18 years old) to die in other countries.
  2. Won't stop fighting: Zelenskyy believes Putin will never voluntarily end the war - he must be forced to stop.
  3. Fears losing control: Putin desperately wants to keep Ukraine under Russia's influence, just like he's doing with Georgia and Moldova.
  4. Lives in the past: He dreams of bringing back Soviet-era power and territory.

  Zelenskyy compares Putin to "Voldemort" from Harry Potter and says he's "deaf" to peace talks. He believes Putin needs strength against him, not just friendly conversations.